S 4 EP 8: Program Sustainability and How to Make It Work feat. Kam Green

J.Lee: 0:14

Hello, hello everyone. Welcome to school. After our podcast, where we talk about four things related to attitude, time, programming and education, I am your host, jay Lee, and today's topic we're going to be diving into program sustainability. How do programs set themselves up to have that longevity to serve the communities for years and years to come? So to have this conversation I feel it can bring would be amazing to have this conversation with, because she does a lot of work with programs but also staff development. She has a couple of programs herself that she's involved in, but she also serves the community as well, been doing it for quite a while over, like 15 plus years. So what person better to ask? So she's going to be joining us in our conversation today. So we're going to go ahead and dive right in. Community Corner is a segment of the show that allows guests on myself to share tips, advice or information on a specific topic with young people, families or community members. Without further ado, let's go ahead and get into our Community Corner conversation. Hello, hello, we are now in our Community Corner segment. So, cam, my Community Corner question for you is how can communities help after school programs become more sustainable when it comes to having longevity of a program, how can the community contribute to the sustainability of that program?

Kam: 1:44

I think inviting them in to be a part of whatever work that they're doing. I think that that collaboration is critical for sustainability. So, whether you know, let's say it's the local business can they have the after school program doing some kind of marketing for them, doing some kind of volunteer project, doing some kind of just like visit, but just having some consistent connection of bringing them in or them coming in, especially if they're a business that has a long standing, you know, time in the community. I think having some kind of established, regular connection. If the after school program is doing artwork, can they hang it up in the business. If the business is doing something, can they have the students planning and promoting it and just that cross collaboration. That is critical for sustainability because it just keeps that loop in there and it gets more people involved and more people engage. And then everything that you're producing, let's say on the after school side, it could be tied to something that you're dropping in the community and it just expands that reach and I think a lot of community organizations and businesses they don't take advantage of. You know, students after school programs. I mean it depends on the age. It could even be like a workforce development thing. If we talk about working with older kids, where things drop off after school, they still need opportunities, they still got need guidance, they still need focus and they still need connection. So I mean there could be opportunity for internships, for shadowing and I'm like, and kids are smart, kids are tech savvy. Like, take advantage of you know those resources and have them brainstorm. You know everything from a marketing campaign to you know this social media bit and that you know that whole part. Kids would love to get involved with stuff like that. So maybe that's the way, but I think it just has to be established of this is how we see this population can be a part of the work we're doing. It doesn't have to be this extra laborious thing. It's like we do this all the time. We can bring them in to connect on this and then it just makes it easy.

J.Lee: 3:47

In my mind, and have to be complicated and have to be complicated. Well, that's good. Okay, and that's real good. So, with that being said, we're going to go ahead and transition into our interview section. Well, welcome back to the show, ma'am. How are you?

Kam: 4:09

I am doing well, so happy to be back with you.

J.Lee: 4:13

Awesome, awesome. Well, thank you for being here and to have this important conversation with us about programs, sustainability and some things that programs can do, short term and long term, to make sure that they have that longevity to see generations in their communities serve in what they do. So, for the people that may and may not know you, even though you are returning gas at this point, you like family. You like family. Go ahead and give them a small introduction of who you are, but also let them know about your businesses that you created and you know why you created. Re think after school and get up and drive.

Kam: 4:50

Okay, hello, hello, I'm so happy to be back. This is one of my favorite things to talk about after school. My name is Cam Green. I've been working in this space for 20 plus years and I am a product of after school programming and so currently my day job. I work with Goodwill of Southern Nevada and do a lot of programming and workforce development and try to find ways to tie that into education in the school districts as well. And then by night I have a couple of companies. One of them is called rethink after school and one of them is called get up and thrive. Rethink after school was created and it's all about figuring out how to support after school professionals but also figure out how to provide quality, engaging program, which our students so desperately deserve to have in every space. So it's all about thinking about how we use that time and literally just to put the title in there how to rethink after school. There's so much that we can be doing during that time and we have come a long way in that space with the people who work in that space and the commitment and the laws and the funding. So I'm so excited to have seen that up at the last few years and then also get up and thrive. Get up and thrive is my life motto, and it's all about positive self talk. At the end of the day the beginning I feel like everything that we do comes down to that. Positive self talk is student success and adult success. It really matters what we tell ourselves and our personal narrative, whether we're going to get into something or talk ourselves out of something, and so I'm all about them always promoting that inner voice and building it up so that when you're sitting alone by yourself or questioning or doubting, you have something in your brain that is saying the opposite, like try it. You might not be able to do it by yourself, you might have to ask for help. So that's the other piece of that, but I work that into every part of my day, from being a mom to being overorganizations. It's positive self talk. It's just a critical, critical vehicle for me.

J.Lee: 6:48

Oh, that is so true. Well, that brings us to my next question. For you, for programming, right? So for program sustainability, let's go ahead and define it for the people that may or may not know. So, what is program sustainability, and why do you think it's such a hot topic right now, in this moment?

Kam: 7:03

no-transcript. I think program sustainability is just all about being able to continue and have a continuation of services you know over time and being able to deliver on what you say you're going to deliver on and what you need to deliver on for the people that you're working with. And I think it's such a hot topic right now because people are struggling with it right, and a lot of times it has to do with the turnover of staffing or the turnover and funding and things like that. And you know programs kind of feel like they're up and down or you know, or even based on needs. So I always say, just assume you have no money, you're going to have staffing change and like go in with the mindset of all that stuff is going to change. So then what can I do to sustain myself, given that I know that and I think a lot of people just accept that Now it might not be the case, but if you go in accepting that you're going to be thinking about some of those other opportunities for you to engage and have in place, that can be maybe a little bit more steady or you're going to be ready to pivot when something changes, as opposed to feeling like you're surprised, like oh wait, you know, I lost five people. Like, people are going to leave, people are not going to show up to work. We might only have a dollar, you know. So sometimes when I do activities, I'm like if I give you this piece of paper, I just happen to have a grape right here, that's so random and you know, and this, what activity like? I literally do that as a session with groups and I'm like what can you do to create an engagement activity for kids? They have a takeaway, they feel good and it's connected to this Go like that's literally how you have to think and if you operate in that space, then it kind of relieves you from needing to have certain things and it gives you opportunity to pivot Awesome.

J.Lee: 8:46

That's very true, because you have to know when to pivot, especially in this game and in this time and age right now. What's going on? So, with that being said, when it comes to being sustainable as a program, what are some things executive teams or CEOs have to keep in mind to maintain their programs? So, like you mentioned, when it's time to pivot, you might lose some people. What are some things that they can do to let that blow be less damaging to their organization?

Kam: 9:11

Yeah. So I think you know all that stuff is good, being ready to pivot, and you have to have that conversation. The other part is just partnership and you know, like we talked about before, is using those community resources. So they're going to be people around you in the community that you may not have even thought of creating a partnership with, and look at them. A lot of times they will have been around for longer for everything from, like, a grocery store to a doctor's office, to a dental facility, to a gas station, and say like how can I partner with them and bring them in as having shown as a sustainable, you know, business in the community being something for me? So does that mean one? Would they be willing to send out a volunteer to do a program? Do they have something within their company that they're already doing? Because a lot of times people are like, oh, wait, a minute, I didn't know you had that available, I didn't know you had that program, I didn't know you had that scholarship. So it's the assumptions that we make that somebody is not doing something and we don't reach out. And then the other assumption is that we think everybody knows what we're doing and if they had something that fit, they would come find us. No, you have to go find them. So I would say I always encourage people to make sure that, especially when you look around your block, you need to have had a conversation with everybody, in that you know quick radius to say, hey, how can we partner, how can we connect? Would you be willing to come out and do a program? Can we bring our kids out for a visit, so that you have these other people that are extension of your staff in your program? And it just makes it better. And then when you're thinking about working with students and general staff, making that connection, it's not just this bubble of we're in this room, in this after school program. It's like, okay, we're going to take this, what we're talking about here and we're going to show you what it looks like in the real world and in life and being in your community, because that's the ultimate goal. We don't want them to have everything right in this bubble in this room. We want them to take it and use it in these other places. So I think that a lot of times programs are at a deficit by not saying, hey, what is it that you all do? Here's what we do. Do you see an opportunity for collaboration or even leveraging corporate structure or how they're doing things to maybe take some of that into the way you're running your program? Again, you see a business or a chain or something like that that you know has sustainability. You know they're making money, you know they're doing well. Maybe it's just a conversation, especially if we're talking CEO to CEO or director to director, like hey, we might need some framework or some systems or how are you all doing this, and you just take it and you pivot and you put it on top of what you're doing, as opposed to trying to. One of the things I always say is you know. One don't say I can't say I need help, you know. And two, you're not required to have it all figured out. So if we try to go into these silos and like we got to figure out everything for our students, that when you could really just go say, hey, how are you all sustaining this? You know grocery business over 30 years in the community. You know what structures are you using, how are you engaging your staff? Because everybody's dealing with similar things of turnover. So instead of trying to figure it out all by yourself, maybe you collaborate with them and maybe you find out like, hey, we have people who don't want to work in this space, but want to work in this space. Maybe it's a cross collaboration of saying helping people find their fit. So I think sometimes it's just a simple as not making those assumptions, having those conversations, letting people know what you're struggling with, especially if you're looking out of your you know window and you see seven businesses, you need to have talked to all of them about what you're doing, what your needs are, and then vice versa, what they're doing, what their needs are, and those kind of partnerships those create for me. I think they are the foundation of sustainability, especially when you're talking about supporting youth and people in a community. It can't just be I'm gonna go over here and do this, you're gonna. That doesn't make sense because at the end of the day, when they walk out, they're gonna walk into your store, your hospital, your this, your that. So if we talk to each other, you know, and we say, hey, we're focusing on this, you do this. We could actually collaborate, and I think it always makes for better outcomes. I'm like queen collaboration. I'm like how can we collaborate? Oh, we, how can we work together? That's a question that I'm always asking and it also lifts some of the burden. I'm not ever doing anything by myself and in 90% of the time it doesn't even make sense. You know, for me to operate Like that. So I think that's a critical thing and people I think miss out on. They go in rooms and they go behind closed doors and they plan by themselves. So include the community and include the kids that you're serving and the youth you're serving, and it just opens up the possibilities.

J.Lee: 13:48

That is true. You bring up a good point, but hold on, hold up, hold up, hold up. We're gonna take a quick break Everybody. So we're gonna come back to this conversation. Go ahead, get up, stretch your legs. We just next to what you do. You're gonna pay these bills and come right back, so do not go too far. All right, we'll see you in a minute. Are you a program director or thinking of starting a program? Maybe you need new curriculum that focuses on character development or technical skills. Maybe you need help establishing effective program logistics to have an impactful program culture, or, overall, you just need a program evaluation. Well, school After Hours Consulting case here to help Contact us at schoolafterhourscom and our contact information is in the show notes. Hope to hear from you soon. Hello, hello everyone, welcome back. We're just coming back from break and our topic of discussion is programs sustainability how to have longevity in this game of after school time programming. So some of the things that we talked about which I thought was a really, really good point, is collaboration with your community as a program, seeing what resources are available to you, but also coming with the attitude of service how can you help as well as how can you get. I think that's very important and, like Cam said, you can't expect them to come to you. You have to be able to go out to them. Just shop around and let people know what you have and what you offer, because sometimes you could be literally down the block from somebody and you offer a specific service and the company down the block had no idea. But yeah, you are all on the same block together. So that brings me to another conversation to have, cam, as we're going into partnering and being part of community, seeing what we can, you know how we can collaborate within our community. What are some of the things that people have to keep in mind as they go on that search of collaboration with other businesses?

Kam: 15:46

I think, just really defining you know their story and what they do and again, like we talked about before, not making assumptions like this is our program, this is what we do, this is who we hope to serve, and then also reiterating these are the same people who live in this community. I think that's an easy sell and, again, I gather a lot of people just don't know what's happening behind closed doors. But I think, making that connection and then also from a business perspective, it's like, hey, we're working with youth who have families, who are buyers, who are you know, whatever, like there's some relationship there that can be, you know, inputted as well. That is important to local business owners and things like that. I think, just really making it very clear of what your outcomes are, what you're aiming to do, and then just establishing, and even if it's just like you don't know what the ask is saying and we need help with that, you know, like any ideas were open, we're welcome. And if you have a specific ask, like we're doing this program and we need you know five of these, 10 of these, or we need that, then have that specific ask. And then the other thing is too when you meet somebody you know you don't want to ask for something on the first time, but sometimes that's okay. But one of the things you can ask for is is there anybody else who you could think of we should connect to? Because your network and things like that, that's going to be more valuable than so many other things. So if each person you meet and connect with you ask them to connect you to somebody else, then you're expanding the people that you can collaborate with and it might take you past that block. But at the end of the day, that's a good thing, right? Because you could be going back asking them for funding and we don't know what we don't know and we don't know who we don't know. You know until we know them, and sometimes you just need that introduction, sometimes like I never thought about that person, or I didn't know they did that, or I didn't know they had a fund or something like that. So don't make assumptions. Ask and then be very clear on this is who we are, this is what we do, this is who we want to serve. We need help, or you know, either generically or specifically. We need this. You know, and it might not come from you. You know anybody. Do you have a person? Just be okay, you don't have that conversation, right.

J.Lee: 17:55

And you do bring up a good point, because who you're talking to, they may not have exactly what you need, but if you never ask, you know. Well, do you know somebody? Yeah, that could point me in the right direction of getting you know this need met and you know it brings up a different dialogue and that person may not have what you need at this moment, but it doesn't mean that they won't, that they won't have what you need later down the line. So it's also important to kind of nourish those relationships. I feel like as you go, just to continue to pour into your community, as they pour into you.

Kam: 18:27

Absolutely yeah, and it's all about that. You know that cycle of you know how can we support each other Because, at the end of the day, you want your community to be thriving, and it's not just about your program being sustainable. But then local grocery shops are closing down but, like you know, you want everything to be operating at the height and everybody getting what they need, what they need, and that's where the collaboration comes in the connection, as opposed to everybody operating the silos when we're trying to serve the exact same people every single day. Like you know, you got to connect that, to connect the dots.

J.Lee: 19:05

Right, exactly. So one of the things that you did bring up in our previous conversation or the before the break, is Not just knowing the pivot, but you may have some staff that might leave. You may have some staff that come in. You got to retrain. But also, we don't talk about this money you may have only a dollar left after getting like a couple of hundred for the beginning of the year, depending on expenses and cost of programming nowadays, because everything is rising. So my question is like what are some of the strategies, programs to you to get ahead of those struggles in that cost?

Kam: 19:41

I think it again. It comes down to getting out of silos. You know, like, yes, there's there's grant there, there's government grants and a lot of those are larger. So sometimes people get so hyper focused on, oh, I need this $500,000 to run this program and I'm going to go after this, I'm going to write this grant if they don't get it, they, at the same time they should have been figuring out Well, you know, $20,000 can add up from these different people to 500. So, just thinking about those micro opportunities to engage people, you know so, is it a smaller campaign? Is it a local campaign from businesses to say, hey, we want 100% of local businesses within 10 miles to support us with $10, like whatever? But find a way to engage and say, hey, we're going to put up some kind of banner to say we have 100% local community support and get some kind of buy in. But you just have to be thinking about everybody. You know, not everybody, but there are so many more people who have money that they can contribute that you might not be thinking about. Like, are you going to the gas station to ask for funding? You know, like, literally, who is your person, who's your community development? You know partner a lot of and a lot of the smaller businesses. They don't have a community development person, but they don't even know how to engage in that or think about that. And when you pitch to them they're like, oh, we would love to give you know X number of dollars. Or oh, we have. Like I was talking to somebody recently and they were just saying like, oh, we have all these hospital beds and things like that because we did an upgrade. And they're like wait, what? And there was this clinic that needed hospital beds. We're like, well, give them to you. And it was just literally having that conversation. So I think, yes, you go after the big pockets of money, but think about, you know, if you're starting with your local community. Have you gone into each of them and asking, hey, could you donate, you know, $500? Or do you have a program? Does your corporation have a program? Thinking about individual donors who work at those companies, who maybe don't even have kids but live in the community and want the kids to thrive? So it's not just going after the people who look a certain kind of way and this and that, and oh, you have to go after people who work in education and get funding. No, it could be somebody who's completely, you know, distant, some random, you know auto repair shop, but it's like, but there are repairing cars for parents who drive their kids to schools, or families got to make that connection for them and ask, like, I say, what's? What's the worst that can happen? You know, if you ask you could stay the same. The best thing that can happen is they say I have $10 and you can get a pizza, you know, for a pizza party, you know, and it's those smaller kind of things. I think you have to have diversity in the income that you're looking for. It cannot be all government based. It cannot be all your one or two same people that are tapped, because even those people look at like, how are you bringing in new funders and new donors? What are you going after? They want to see that to a lot of them, for you know when they're giving. So just, I think, thinking outside the box and not counting anybody out, you know, don't count anybody out. Even college students, you know, sometimes will give to something and like, oh yeah, I'll give a dollar to that. Think about if you ask every college student in the area to say we just need $1 from you. And every time we get five from a college student, we're going to put a handprint up with the names and it's like high five for school, like it's different ways that you can bring together Again my grandmother when I was younger she would get so upset if you walk past the penny like you would get in trouble because she would be like you act like pennies don't add up. And so I think a lot of times we get caught up and we have a lot of stuff going on and just going after those big dollars that we don't say well, we're going to have this pocket that's going to give us 500. We're going to have this pocket, a thousand, this pocket. And then that's the way you create that diversity and income. And then you bring in new funders who are like wait, what are you donating to? What's that about? And people can come in and give where they are. Everybody can't give 500,000, right, and the government might not give it to you. And then if you haven't planned for other things, then you're stuck, you know, saying, oh, we need this money to run our program, so we can't do anything. And then sometimes it's going to be an in-kind donation Can you donate bus time, can you donate a printer? So, like as you're right now, your budget, you're saying, oh, we need, you know, $3,000 for buses. Well, is it Greyhound? Is it this bus company? Is it some luxury bus line? Have you asked them if they will be willing to donate a bus for a field trip? You've got to think about. Maybe you don't need the money, you need the service, you need the whatever. So I think you have to have that item over here and they say, well, if they don't give us the money, would they just give us the, you know the service or, with somebody, sponsor that kind of thing. So I think there's no box. You can't put yourself in a box and you can't count anybody out when you're trying to count those points. So we will take it, give me your penny and you know we'll put that in a bucket too.

J.Lee: 24:26

I know that's right, but you brought up a good point of being mindful that you might not always need cash. You might not always need money. You may need a service or some level of sponsorship that requires, you know, maybe you attending a field trip to keep our own children and maybe you need assistance with a fair that you're doing within the school, someone more so donating their time rather than their money, right, but also acknowledging those people that are contributing to the community, so that are contributing to your program, right? So how did you begin to acknowledge those individuals, but also like being mindful not to tug on them too much, because I feel like, like I said, that's a thing being mindful of you know your consistent donors, like they might be at a point where they want to tap out.

Kam: 25:21

I think it's, you know, having a consistent communication, definitely giving them you know their accolades and awards and saying we appreciate you and they're always making a connection to some kind of success story. You know, because you gave this and no matter what level they gave, you supported this, you helped us do this and these are the outcomes you know that we're looking at. But then I think you know, like you said, you just always have to be built in a wider pipeline so that it's not constantly going to that same person, especially if it's physical time. So it's like really thinking about how you're tapping into people and saying, hey, we have these slots you can jump into, and not making the offering easy for them to jump into, easy for them to sign up whether it's a sign up genius or whatever kind of form you got going on but not making it feel like they always have to be the people and that's just has to be an ongoing part of building that pipeline from you know again, is it college students? Is it the retired? You know population. Are there some states where you know AARP has programs where they will pay? You know seniors of a certain age to come in and do work. Have you tapped into that population Like there's a lot of different places you can engage in. You just have to be willing to ask and just keep those wheels turning and keep expanding. You know the people that you're working with and not just have your five go to people.

J.Lee: 26:41

All right. So that brings me to my next question. For some of those things that you mentioned as far as program challenges go when it comes to sustainability, what are some of the strategies that programs can use to get ahead of those struggles like staffing, you know, cost decreasing, you know you started off with $10,000, now you're down to a dollar, all those things. So what are some of the things that programs could do to get ahead of those situations?

Kam: 27:08

I think you know, one, acknowledging that that's going to happen and just making those assumptions, but two, I think, really thinking outside the box in terms of where you're getting your people and your funding from. And so, again, it's good, I know a lot of programs where, after government funding or specific kind of funding, or they're relying on state or school funding or even maybe a little bit from the parents. But start to think about looking around your community first. Some of these other companies do. They have programs where they, you know, do community development and they'll give funding, or maybe they're not even aware of that, but making sure you go out and you communicate what your program is doing, who you're working with in the community, and offering them an opportunity, if they have it, to be able to give back to your program. And again, like we talked about before, not making that assumption that they know what you're doing, they know you're over there. Never make that assumption. So here, this is what we do, this is who we serve, and it's the same people that you're working with, you know. Do you have an opportunity to give? And we talked about not only is it funds, it might be something in kind, it might be a service. It might be a volunteer person. If we think about the ultimate goal for our youth is getting them out into you know some kind of workforce, whether it be entrepreneurship or working for you know business, that kind of exposure is good. And so having those key terms that you can even link in businesses with, to say, like workforce development, internships, building the future workforce sometimes you just have to meet them where they are and make sure they know what you need. And again, as many people as possible, whether it's they can give you know a small amount or a larger amount, you really want to have that pool of diversity and the more you do that, the more people you have exposure to and those people might tell other people. And again, those dollars add up. As opposed to we're only going to go after state funding, we're only going to have this grant. This grant like there's so much, there's so many other resources out there, and even like a college student may be able to get funding. Don't count anybody out when it comes to your coins is what I always say. And if you ask with clarity and they know what you're doing, then don't make that assumption. It might not be them, but they might be able to connect you. They might say, oh well, we don't do it, but our corporate office a lot of people don't know corporations will support. I used to work for CVS health and we could choose organizations that we wanted to donate to and they would select organizations based on people pitching. So I mean you could have an advocate within an organization who speaks on your behalf and say, hey, there's this really great program that's serving these students in the community and that corporation might give on behalf of that. So don't count people out that don't have kids, that don't. Everybody has a connection if they live, especially if they live in that community. So that's where you start. But again, it may be something you're not even thinking about local gas station, auto repair company. There's a way to make a connection and even if it's just like that sounds like a really good cause, give them the opportunity to be aware of what you need and who you're serving. Don't count them out.

J.Lee: 30:05

I know, that's right, that's so good. All right, y'all. We can't hold too long. We can't hold too long, so we are going to go ahead and transition into our professionals lounge. Professionals lounge is a segment of the show that allows guests to share advice with other practitioners in the OST and youth development field about how they can begin growing their gifts and talents, but also develop themselves as professionals in the field. Here's our professionals lounge conversation. So my question for you, cam for professionals lounge, is what can frontline staff do to make themselves more marketable for leadership or management decisions? Thank you.

Kam: 30:49

That is an excellent question, and so I think one of the most important things to think about is that, especially in this space, everything is a transferable skill, and I think that a lot of people count themselves out and they say, oh, I don't have experience in this, I don't have experience in that, but you really do. It's just about you know how you're making that connection. Customer service is a huge you know skill that's used across the board, that leaders need to use, and you just need to speak to that. I have this skill and this is how we use it. Education and teaching and training is a huge important thing in being a leader. So if you've been able to, you know, train and work with youth and do programming, you just need to translate that language. Some people need that connection and you have to speak the language that they're speaking, but you could always make a connection to what you're doing, to something else and just draw that you know line very clearly and don't count yourself out, you know, I think a lot of people. Again, the marketability is you won't even put yourself in the room or, you know, throw your name in the hat because you feel like it doesn't match up, but you just have to see how it does. Oh, if I created this lesson plan for these kids and I got them to engage and had learning transfer, it's the same thing if you're learning new skill, you know, in a particular kind of job, or you know, trying to teach leaders or trying to, you know, do training and development for employees. So, just, you know, make that connection, make that connection. And I think and always say I'm like I say hire teachers, hire educators, hire afterschool professionals, because we have done it all, we do it all, we wear all the hats and we figure out a way to help people feel engaged, connected and how to teach people in a way where they actually have learning transfer. And I'm like that's what leaders are supposed to do. So I'm like these people working to meet these spaces, those are the people that you need. And so, to loop back to that positive self-talk conversation, as a frontline worker, you have to talk yourself up and say I'm looking at all the stuff I'm doing, you know, with, you know, maybe limited resources. You know, maybe you know students who are being disruptive and you're still trying and making, you know tries forward, that's marketable, you know like, and unfortunately even in the adult space, if you. You know, just working with adults, you have to work with difficult people, right, but the great part about it is having the skills from this space. They carry over so well. I used to teach preschool, kindergarten, I used to work in an afterschool program and I use those same skills when I work with my executives. Now you know like I might be using different language, different vocabulary, but I'm using the same skills and resources. I learned being on the frontline, working, teaching and things like that Good stuff.

J.Lee: 33:20

Well, Cam, thank you so much for being on the show. Just a joy having you.

Kam: 33:25

I always appreciate being here having this conversation. You know everything. To me there's always a connection back to afterschool.

J.Lee: 33:33

No, that's right. Well, if people want to get in touch with you to learn more about your services or your business, how do they get in touch?

Kam: 33:40

The best way to get in touch with me is to connect with me on Instagram, at Get Up and Thrive, or you can email me at GetUpandThrive, at gmailcom, and then everything comes back, you know, to that, and then I, you know, filter it out accordingly.

J.Lee: 33:55

All right. Well, everyone, that brings us to the end of our show. If you like what you heard and you enjoyed our conversation, make sure that you're following us on YouTube, but also hit that like button so we know what you are enjoying. You can also find us on other podcast platforms like Apple Podcasts, Spotify and Google Podcasts. If you want to listen to our audio version as well, To get more behind the scenes stuff, make sure that you're following us on our social media accounts Instagram and Facebook at School Actor Hours. Well, that's all I have for today, and the words of Mr Arthur Ashe start where you are, use what you have, do what you can. Until next time, y'all, bye-bye.